Hybris, as usual, from the bishop.  Can that word be associated with the word ‘spin’?

The reason why Rowan appeared to be gracious is merely an illustration of the adage ‘Beggars must always smile.’ He has so utterly made of mess of everything he touches, sort of like Midas in reverse, that it’s the only avenue left to him. Also, the poor man doesn’t have a killer instinct, which explains his endless shilly-shallying on and around every important matter. All sides in the current unpleasantness understand quite well that anything, *anything* he says doesn’t mean much, and nothing much will come of it anyway. Mrs Schori, on the other hand, at least can be respected for her ruthless pursuit of what she considers most expedient for her side.

“As a sign of apology for his disrespect, the Pope offered the Archbishop a golden bishop’s pectoral cross”
Zut alors!  Ce Pierre Whalon - Il est un grand pranksteur n’est pas?  Rit?  Je peux mourir!

The Episcopal Church has pretty well botched the ecumenical thingy on its own.  Whalon’s triumphalism is a shade to apparent, God bless him.  And he has a bit of the condescension going, as well.

Dear Pageantmaster—I’d be inclined to put the question to him directly, which is easily enough done at his website. It did seem a fairly excessive claim for a public statement by a Bishop, and not one that would be Lambeth Palace would want to stand by if so.

Dear Prof. Seitz - You mean there is more available on his dedicated website?  How wonderful - this stuff is priceless.

So very sad - there must be some technical phrase to describe when one says a positive thing such as “God bless them” but evidently means precisely the opposite.

It is so tempting to pursue a Girardian reading of all of this - Anglicans, bitterly divided amongst themselves, achieve some kind of union precisely by identifying the RCs as scapegoat.

#6. With respect (and having served the parish in Munich for several summers and knowing a bit of the ‘Episcopal Convocation of Churches in Europe’) I doubt Bp Whalon is so busy that he does not inhabit his blog/website regularly. Unlike the Diocese of Europe (CofE, erstwhile Diocese of Gibralter), which has a sizeable number of churches, the American convocation is very small. Many may not know but when the PB in the US zone gave up having a diocese, the irregularity of this was covered by ceding Europe to the PB (who then routinely appointed a suffragan to cover things; it is a small affair). I doubt being ‘Bishop of American Convocation in Europe’ is such a busy affair that +Whalon is not able to respond to your question.

#8 Thanks, that is interesting.  So Bishop Whalon works for the PB?  I know he has in the past been invited to meetings of our house of bishops for some reason or other.  Quite useful to have a pair of ears on the ground, so to speak I expect.

I may be a Roman Catholic priest but I had to gasp when I read this:  Mary Tudor, the daughter of Henry and Catherine, renewed close relations between the Church of England and the papacy only six years after her father’s death. So that is what the fires of Smithfield and the Protestant martyrs were about!  Renewing close relations.  What bathos.  I would think that from a Protestant perspective it looked more like standing firm for conscience sake even at the cost of a terrible death.

#9—it has been a while since I was in Munich. Jeffrey Rowthorn was the Suffragan in Europe in the meantime (he was a colleague at Yale Divinity). Because he was Welsh, there was greater cooperation between Gilbralter and American Convocation. Whether that resulted in a change of status for the present incumbent I do not know, except to say, it would then mean the arrangement set up for an ECUSA PB was in abeyance. I doubt that has happened, but then, it was always an odd arrangement. Yes, previously, the PB appointed these bishops (usually retired). Whalon is of course not retired. Money is a factor here. The convocation, as I said, does not amount to much in terms of parishes, esp compared with the Diocese of Europe. One can see this quickly by checking online.

#10 Terry Tee
I think we are seeing the difference between the English and the French way of seeing things.  A French friend once explained it thus: given some event, the English person will say: “give me all the evidence, records and data, and I will assess them and give you an answer.”  The French person would say:“but how ridiculous, you can never have all the evidence, no what I would do is that I will make a hypothesis about what has happened.  Then I will look at some facts and see if my hypothesis works.  If the facts do not entirely fit my hypothesis then I shall amend my hypothesis.  In this way I will be able to propose an answer to what has happened”
The Englishman of course thinks: “how dishonest”

So that may explain what Bishop Whalon is doing: he knew that Mary was Henry’s daughter and he had not been very nice to the abbots and to the Pope.  He knows that Mary was a devout Roman Catholic, so it is only natural to hypothesise that she would wish to renew close relations with the papacy, and that she should wait a decent period after her father’s death to do so.  Unless what you know about the Protestant martyrs will disprove Whalon’s Gallic hypothesis he may see no need to change it.

Similarly Bishop Whalon may know that Archbishop Rowan is not very happy with not being consulted about the Apostolic Constitution.  Bishop Whalon also knows that AB Rowan has been to Rome and has had a long 20 minute meeting with the Pope.  Hearing that the Pope gave to the Archbishop a lovely golden cross, Bishop Whalon has hypothesised that this lovely and valuable present is a sign of a desire to renew close relations after his rude breach; indeed it must be symbolic of his abject apology to Dr Williams.

There you have it in a nutshell - the English and the French way of looking at things.

Whalon is an American who was serving a parish in Florida, so far as I know, before going to the small convocation in Europe. You are generous to put this down to French v English.

#13 Ah well Professor Seitz - it was just my hypothesis.  Perhaps I should stay away from his blog in case I catch even more of it.

No—please write and ask about the apology claim. I think you are right in wondering about that idea, groundless from what we can tell.

#15 Prof Seitz - many thanks - I have posted the following comment on the bishop’s site:

Pageantmaster
Dear Bishop Whalon:

“Archbishop Williams decided to keep a long-planned appointment with Benedict XVI. As a sign of his apology for disrespect, the Pope offered the Archbishop a golden bishop’s pectoral cross.”

I have not heard or read this anywhere else.  Can you please let us know the evidence you rely on for your assertions [1]  that the Pope apologised to the Archbishop for “disrespect” and [2] that the gift of the golden cross was offered as a “sign of his apology.”

Thank you in advance for clearing this matter up.
mardi 1 décembre 2009 - 03:14

http://web.mac.com/pwhalon/Bp_Pierre_Site/Blog/Entrées/2009/11/26_The_Pope,_Rowan_Williams,_and_Henry_VIII.html#

Oh dear oh dear . . . Pageantmaster is causing trouble.

It seems to me as if he is being Terribly Divisive, by asking such a question. 

In response to this comment—“there must be some technical phrase to describe when one says a positive thing such as “God bless them” but evidently means precisely the opposite”—in the South we say “bless her heart” when we mean “oh dear, what a crazed thing for her to do.”

1. Yes - God bless you, [edited]
One senses that the visible reconciliation (within Anglicanism let alone with the See of Rome) may not, in fact, be right at the top of his priorities.

2. I should say that I’ve found this whole debacle depressing. The ABC finds it within powers to declare on behalf of Anglicanism that the period of reception for women’s presbyteral and episcopal ministry is over. (Yet most Provinces don’t have women bishops and some still don’t have women priests). He’s able to declare in public his anxiety at the rudeness of the See of Rome’s actions - whilst apparently not feeling able to do so quite so unequivocally when his own church “family” cries out for help - when bishops are deposed, when priests and bishops are “renounced” without any right of appeal, when Christians take each other to court, when bishops lie in public and so on and so on.

I love him and admire him but can’t help thinking of this: “What father among you, if his son asks for bread, would give him a stone?” (Luke 11.11)

[Slightly edited by Elf]

Bishop Whalon is quite obviously engaging in what has become a full-time job for most ‘theologians’ in TEC, as well… fantasizing, bless his little heart.

[Slightly edited by Elf]

The more articles I read on the Pope’s offer the more the Episcopalians sound like little girls.

“The Vatican can rest assured that we Anglicans will not create “Roman-rite jurisdictions” for unhappy Roman Catholics!”

Excuse me, but isn’t that just exactly what Anglicanism has purported itself to be for 500 years?

17.
Hi Sarah,

Three southern belles were on the veranda sipping mint juleps when the first one said, “My daddy is so rich he gave me ridin’ lessons, and he built me a place with stables, a dozen horses, and everythin’ just right.

The third southern belle said, “Isn’t that nice.”

The second Southern belle said, “My daddy is so rich he sent me on a ‘round-the-world tour, and I saw the most interestin’ things, and dined with royalty, and I had the most excitin’ time.

And the third southern belle said, “isn’t that nice.”

Then the third southern belle said, “Well, my daddy is so rich he sent me to an exclusive finishin’ school where they taught me to say, “isn’t that nice” when I meant to say, “@#$!* %$&!.”

-AC

Heh.

Now now . . . we don’t need exclusive finishing schools to learn to say things we don’t quite mean.  ; > )

BTW, was the ABC in his address in Rome, that Whalon quotes, asserting that the sacrament of ordination is a “second order question” for Anglicans?

Then Father Whalon was priest at my in laws parish before being Peter Principled up to his current position.  In his defense I will say he showed great care and empathy when my FIL required bypass surgery.

As to my opinion of him outside of this pastoral care.  Suffice it to say that ego and him are very well acquainted.

I would venture to say that most Anglo-Catholic congregations and their devotional societies are in fact a kind of Roman-Rite jurisdictions. The vast majority of these members are former Roman Catholics who have found in Anglo-Catholicism a true spiritual home. Many of them even use Roman Rite liturgies both ancient and modern.
Anglo-Catholicism represents the brightest and the best of Anglican thought, piety and practice. A new Oxford movement is surely the best hope for a renewed Anglicanism.
All other ground is sinking sand.