The legislation, however, requires that any loans authorized under the measure have to be guaranteed by the federal government. To do that Congress needs to appropriate 3.7 billion dollars for the insurance premiums, automakers said.

That guarantee and the $3.7B in premiums (or the federal government’s assumption of the risk directly) is the subsidy, Mr Martin. How dumb do you think the taxpayers are?

On of my favorite song writers has always been Tom Paxton. I can now dust off an apparently au curraunt golden oldie,
I Am Changing My Name To Chrysler
by Tom Paxton

Oh, the price of gold is rising out of sight,
And the dollar is in sorry shape tonight.
What a dollar use to get us
Now won’t get a head of lettuce,
No, the economic forecast isn’t bright.
But amidst the clouds I spot a shining ray,
I begin to glimpse a new and better way.
I’ve devised a plan of action,
Worked it down to the last fraction,
And I’m going into action here today:

Cho: I am changing my name to Chrysler,
I am going down to Washington D.C.
I will tell some power broker,
“What you did for Iacocca
Would be perfectly acceptable to me.”
I am changing my name to Chrysler,
I am leaving for that great receiving line.
When they hand a million grand out,
I’ll be standing with my hand out,
Yes sir, I’ll get mine.

When my creditors come screaming for their dough,
I’ll be proud to tell them all where they can go.
They wonÕt have to yell and holler,
They’ll be paid to the last dollar
Where the endless streams of money seem to flow.
I’ll be glad to show them all what they must do.
ItÕs a matter of a simple form or two.
It’s not just remuneration, itÕs a lib’ral education,
Makes you kind of glad that IÕm in debt to you.

Cho.

Since the first amphibian crawled out of the slime,
We’ve been struggling in an unrelenting climb.
We were hardly up and walking
Before money started talking,
And it’s said that failure is an awful crime.
It’s been that way a millenium or two;
Now it seems there is a different point of view.
If you’re a corporate Titanic
And your failure is gigantic,
Down in Congress there’s a safety net for you.

Cho

No.  Make better cars.  I’m done sending money to incompetent businesses.

#3. Yes, they are stupid, belligerent, short-sighted and greedy. They have also victimized the American public for years with their poorly engineered, inefficient, horrible cars. They had been warned and warned again, and here we are again—blackmailed.

There needs to be some conditions this time. Once again we see, “privatize profits, socialize losses.”  Let’s here it again for those unregulated free markets (except when it doesn’t work—then look for the taxpayer)!!!

Ford, for example, has a great car they sell only in Europe.  And its built in Britain.  Unfortunately, it runs on diesel.  It gets 65 miles to the gallon. 

Why is that?

John, you are totally right. I was recently in the UK and it’s amazing what they make elsewhere! The worst part of it all is the way you’re made to feel guilty for not “buying American” when they keep serving up terrible cars that they won’t/can’t inflict on the European market. Off with their heads!

#3. Yes, they are stupid, belligerent, short-sighted and greedy. They have also victimized the American public for years with their poorly engineered, inefficient, horrible cars. They had been warned and warned again, and here we are again—blackmailed.

There needs to be some conditions this time.

How about “no public money?”  I’m a big believer in that, personnally.  It might even be a gift in disguise insofar as the companies that have made poor business decisions will disappear, with others that are wiser for their errors springing up to replace them.  Looked at that way, the Big Three are the greatest obstacles to reviving the American auto industry, not its greatest hope.

Oh, and I was somewhat of your mind about American cars when I bought a 2007 Toyota Camry about 20 months ago.  It’s easily the worst car I’ve owned in the last 20 years.

Ford, for example, has a great car they sell only in Europe.  And its built in Britain.  Unfortunately, it runs on diesel.  It gets 65 miles to the gallon. 

Why is that?

Because it’s built in the UK, labor prices are high and, given the low value of the dollar right now, the car would cost more than the Toyota Prius.  Combine that with diesel costing more than gas right now, and it’s doubtful the Econetic would be able to compete.

To be fair, diesel fuel has 120k BTUs/gal while gasoline only has 100k BTUs, and that is IF YOU DON’T HAVE ethanol in the gas, which reduces it various amounts depending on blending (another -5% isn’t unusual). So, designing a high mpg car with a diesel engine is a no-brainer and low tech solution, despite Detroit’s apparent inability to do so.

If the Big Three want my business they need to make better cars.  As it is I support the economy in Southern Ontario.  I buy Toyotas built at the plant in Cambridge.

And yet it is OK to continue to spend $10 billion a month on an endless war in Iraq while we get not one red cent from the oil we went to defend.
  I’m not eager to help the car companies either, but at least it would benefit OUR country this time.

#11. We’re fighting not for freedom, but a legacy. Lives for an ego.

If we’re fighting for oil in Iraq, a debatable idea but let’s go with it, we’re fighting not for the oil in iraq but for the stability of the international oil market. We don’t need to buy our oil from Iraq or Iran. We get most of our foreign oil from Canada and Mexico. But if the international market becomes unstable that effects everything. Does anybody remember the last six months?

But what has all this speculation to do with bailing out a failed private industry? Not much I imagine. Let the dead fish sink and the strong fish swim, I say. If the big three fail it is because they refuse or are not permitted to adapt. Bailing them out won’t make them profitable, and a company without profits won’t be able to pay its workers. Nationalizing the auto industry, which is the natural end result of continual bailouts, will only result in low wages and crappy products. History has never demonstrated otherwise.

As a Detroiter, I am saddened at how poorly the American companies have been run, combined with union labor issues.  Heck, each US car you buy has THOUSANDS of dollars in legacy costs (health insurance/pensions for retirees) that are not tacked on the cost of a Japanese car because they have government socialized medicine/pensions.
BUT - I have owned Japanese (Honda), Swedish (Volvo), and American (three Chevy Impalas in a row now) and I have to say I have had fewer mechanical problems with my Chevys AND if there is a problem the repair costs have always been lower for labor and parts.
http://www.stjohnsdetroit.org

I’m a court reporter and did a deposition of a GM employee in 1987.  He had one year of college and was an electrician/supervisor at the Doraville plant near Atlanta.  He made $94,000 a year.  His vacation time and benefits were unbelievable, too.  He did say he worked a lot of overtime.  Keep in mind this as 21 YEARS AGO.  Imagine what he would be making today.  When I heard all this, I knew back then that American auto makers were in trouble.  I don’t think the unions have helped the situation, to say the least.

Several years ago, I was listening to KGO Radio San Francisco…...which is all talk-show, by the way, and the host was interviewing a tow truck operator in Seattle.  His comments were very interesting, since the subject was the most frequently-towed make of cars.  The upshot of this interview was that the most frquently-towed make of automobile was, believe it or not, HONDA! 

Several other callers revealed that the so-called “outstanding Japanese cars” were, fact, towed more often because or mechanical breakdown that the supposedly “inferior” Big Three!  And they were more costly to repair!  I own a 2004 Pontiac Montana extended wheelbase minivan, which I need because I use a wheelchair. 

The van has a lower tailgate sill which makes it easy to load and unload the chair.  My average gas mileage is 19 mpg around town, and 28 mpg on the freeway.  I have never once had to have it towed for repair, nor have I ever had a major service problem with it. 

I tried several Toyota, Kia, and Honda minivans, and none were rated more than simply “adequate” in terms of serviceability and reliability.  I went to our local Pontiac dealer, and have never regretted.  Ditto for our daughter.

I must say that of the five cars I’ve owned (three Buicks, a Chrysler, and now a 2005 VW Golf) I’ve had the most trouble with the Golf (has left me stranded) followed by the Chrysler (always ran, but the convertible top became leaky about 20 months in).  Those two cars combined ages (Chrysler when sold, VW now) are less than any of the Buicks on the date of purchase. 

As for the cars in Europe they don’t offer here, it is mostly a factor of cost.  People are used to paying much much more for a small car on the other side of the pond.  That is starting to change somewhat (MINI Cooper, for example) but we’ve a long way to go.  Over here a small car is still largley seen as something you buy when you can’t afford something better. 

Also, due to a variety of factors diesel is priced very close to gasoline in Europe, making diesels much more competitive.  Here, the greater purchase cost of a diesel engine takes much longer to “pay for itself” through improved mileage, while differences in air pollution standards have made it prohibitively expensive for most companies tob ring their euro-spec diesel engines to the North American market.  That is ending, and we’re starting to see more and more diesels in the States.  VW & Mercedes have both brought 50-state legal diesel engines to market recently, with BMW, Ford, Honda and GM considering it.  Hopefully this will continue, I’d love to get a little GM diesel commuter car to replace the Golf in a year or two.

#17 Buicks have a great service record. Your experience is in accord with the stats.